Fred Thiel, Chairman and CEO, MARA Holdings at MARA Holdings
4.8/5 Rating
Cryptocurrency, AI, Technology, Finance
$1M+/mo

Fred ThielChairman and CEO, MARA Holdings

Fred Thiel leads MARA with a power-first mindset: treat land and electrons as a portfolio of assets. He explains why Bitcoin sold off in a risk-off cascade, how leverage and whale moves amplify fear, and why miners should earn optionality by pairing low-cost energy with modular infrastructure for Bitcoin and inference AI.

Fred Thiel

Fred Thiel

Chairman and CEO, MARA Holdings

MARA Holdings

MARA Holdings

Founder Stats

  • Cryptocurrency, AI, Technology, Finance
  • Started 2010
  • $1M+/mo
  • 50+ team
  • USA

About Fred Thiel

Fred Thiel is Chairman and CEO of MARA Holdings. In this interview, he breaks down why Bitcoin miners saw a risk-off correction, how leverage and macro liquidity shape sentiment, and why the biggest constraint in AI is power. His approach is practical: keep mining strong, build low-cost energy optionality, and move into inference AI with private cloud protections.

Interview

December 20, 2025

Q

You said the market felt frothy. What made you say that?

Question 1 of 17
Fred Thiel

On our Q2 earnings call I said the market was getting a little frothy. We had huge tailwinds from institutional buy in, big inflows to ETFs, and a lot of expectations around Fed rate cuts. When that many positives stack up, people crowd into the same trade, and it gets fragile fast.

Q

What do you think really triggered the November weakness in Bitcoin?

Question 2 of 17
Fred Thiel

It was a couple things back to back. The Fed rate cut suddenly looked like a low likelihood, which created risk off. Then there was a scare around AI assets, debt, and the AI circular economy. Add Japan rate hikes and the carry trade unwind, and it became a compounding effect.

Q

How do older whale wallets impact market psychology?

Question 3 of 17
Fred Thiel

Since late summer we saw older whales with wallets 10 to 13 years old moving. When an old wallet that has not moved in many years moves, people freak out. Some were selling, some were transferring into ETFs, which looks like a sale. In risk off, that fear spreads quickly.

Q

Why does leverage make selloffs feel worse than fundamentals?

Question 4 of 17
Fred Thiel

In a risk off environment, Bitcoin operates a lot like equity in portfolios today. Then you see layered strategies and highly leveraged positions unwind. People pile into short trades on perpetual markets, and when the move goes against them, forced unwinds add more selling pressure on top of everything.

Q

How do you see liquidity and macro policy shaping next year?

Question 5 of 17
Fred Thiel

I think quantitative tightening is officially over and you will start seeing some quantitative easing. The repo market is going to need help, and there are areas where money gets injected into the economy. The upside is liquidity, but the problem is inflation and how you keep it under control.

Q

How do you lead through uncertainty like shutdowns and weak data?

Question 6 of 17
Fred Thiel

A period of uncertainty makes people hesitate. The government shutdown did not help and the lack of data did not help. You focus on what is priced in, what you can control, and avoid panic decisions. Then you look for stable footing and plan what matters between now and next quarters.

Q

When miners look at AI, what is the big risk you see?

Question 7 of 17
Fred Thiel

Borrowing against Bitcoin to invest in AI can be a challenging situation. If Bitcoin price is depressed, those profiles can go negative and it causes issues. Miners should stay focused on mining Bitcoin, then leverage the assets they already have and convert them into higher value options carefully.

Q

What are the main paths miners can take to enter AI?

Question 8 of 17
Fred Thiel

There are multiple ways. You can lease a site to an HPC developer and get a long term lease. Some build a building, buy GPUs, run them, and rent that out. Others do land and power deals with developers. There is also a hybrid model where you mine Bitcoin and operate AI at the same site.

Q

What is MARA’s approach to AI compared to peers?

Question 9 of 17
Fred Thiel

We are moving toward inference AI in the same containerized modular format as our Bitcoin mining. We do not have to build big buildings, and we do not need water cooling, it is air cooled. We think training should be best left to hyperscalers, but inference is where we can play.

Q

Why is private cloud a core requirement for inference AI?

Question 10 of 17
Fred Thiel

If you run inference AI, you run a model and you provision it with data, and that data is like gold. You want to protect it, so private cloud becomes very important. That is part of why we invested in Exaion in France, with strong data sovereignty and data protection capabilities.

Q

Your BTC holdings rose, but you also started selling production. How do you balance that?

Question 11 of 17
Fred Thiel

We announced in our Q3 call we would start selling some of our production Bitcoin, and we have done that. But we still net increase our balances every month anyway. The goal is to fund operations responsibly while keeping a strong balance sheet and growing the asset base over time.

Q

Why aren’t you cutting hash rate to fund an AI pivot?

Question 12 of 17
Fred Thiel

We are certainly not cutting back our hash rate. Global hash rate has not slowed down much, except recently when older equipment shut down after price drops. Many peers are converting capacity they have not brought online yet, or building green field sites, not necessarily ripping out running sites.

Q

How do you explain mining profitability tightening even with high prices?

Question 13 of 17
Fred Thiel

Two things matter: the reward per block and how many blocks you win, which depends on your share of global hash rate. Global hash rate grew all year, so difficulty got harder. If you did not add capacity, you went backwards. Cost structure decides who survives when price dips.

Q

What is the operations lesson on energy costs and hosted models?

Question 14 of 17
Fred Thiel

If you own and operate sites, your cost per kilowatt hour is lower than hosted models. Hosted operators pay more and feel it first when Bitcoin comes down into the 80s or 90s. At our owned and operated sites, we have some of the lowest costs in the industry, which protects margins.

Q

What does your near zero cost energy strategy look like in practice?

Question 15 of 17
Fred Thiel

We operate behind the meter at a wind farm we own, so marginal energy cost can be near zero when the wind blows. We move fully depreciated miners there, so there is no depreciation expense, and they run until they expire. We also do similar low cost work using flare gas in oil fields.

Q

What is the institutional investment thesis for a miner now that ETFs exist?

Question 16 of 17
Fred Thiel

Many investors value us close to the value of our Bitcoin holdings, and mining can get little attribution in market cap. But savvy investors look at our sites and power pipeline. The biggest constraint in AI is power, and the fastest way to get power is converting a mining site, so optionality matters.

Q

What are your next major milestones, and how do you stay focused?

Question 17 of 17
Fred Thiel

Closing the Exaion investment after regulatory approval and finalizing the MPLX deal are key, and we expect both in Q1. We also have international steps like Saudi and France footprints. The focus is treating land and power as a portfolio of assets and maximizing value across Bitcoin and inference AI.

Video Interviews with Fred Thiel

Bitcoin Miners Dumping BTC? MARA CEO Fred Thiel On AI Pivot And Market Selloff

Bitcoin Miners Dumping BTC? MARA CEO Fred Thiel On AI Pivot And Market Selloff

Bitcoin Miners Dumping BTC? MARA CEO Fred Thiel On AI Pivot And Market Selloff

Fred Thiel, CEO of MARA, at the Hill Nation Summit: Bitcoin & Mining

Fred Thiel, CEO of MARA, at the Hill Nation Summit: Bitcoin & Mining

Fireside Chat: Fred Thiel & Patrick J. Witt | MARA Government Affairs

Fireside Chat: Fred Thiel & Patrick J. Witt | MARA Government Affairs